I think you need a PC ignition module to take care of the timing on the PC side.

 

From the little I've seen of the actual PCM maps the timing doesn't really change all that much from gear to gear.....it is mostly the STV's. The term 'TRE' came about many years ago when they actually DID retard the timing in the lower gears for emissions reasons mainly.....but later machinery is more sophisticated and doesn't need to alter the timing so much.

Most of the compliance issues today are from noise emissions rather than tailpipe, and the STV's control this brilliantly. Plus the SV1K is gentle with the STV opening in the lower gears to make the bike more 'friendly'. Isn't that nice! But once you get into the upper gears you are no longer in noise control land so the throttles can be allowed to open more swiftly for better response.

I do wish someone would publish the complete PCM maps so we could compare them to one another, and perhaps put this 'timing retard' business to bed. But...if it makes you feel better to run in the 4th or 5th gear map...have at it!

Oh....with stock compression and cam timing, the whole timing curve is pretty lazy on the 1K and really perks up with some advance. However the absolute top end power is pretty close so advancing there might hurt the power a tad...nothing tremendous, just no gains to be had. At least this has been my experience.

 

you can pretty much go with whatever recoilrob says. he is one of the most knowledgable people on here. i know some stuff but he is probably a master tech or something.

i put a tre unit on my bike and it didnt give it much of a boost. however on the sv1000s especially the 03 models they did retard the timing from the tl1000 settings for safety reasons and user friendly reasons. the tre unit smooths out the lower RPMs a lot. and if you plan to do other mods to your bike then you ABSOLUTELY want a tre unit installed. they are very cheap and easy to plug in. and if your gonna pump the power on the bike then you need your timing to be at TDC instead of like 30% down the decompression stroke.

i have done the aTRE unit a slight tank lifter mod desnorkled and custom sprocket sets for more speed. i havent taken the STV's off my bike yet cause i got to sit on a sv1000 race bike on the dyno and it scared the **** outta me how much power that bike had compaired to my nearly stock sv1000. even with the tie down straps the bike wanted to do a crazy roll on wheelie.

my best advice is this. be careful and listen to rob

 

The Power commander does not interface with the factory set Timing Retard. You will want to add a TRE. It's not a butt dyno modification, so do not expect to "feel" a difference.

You basically have the same mods I have on my bike. To get the full benefit you will need it dyno tuned.

 

I have the tre and power commander, I had the tre before the PC3 and it did make a gradual improvement. Now I am going custom single exhaust and I will eventually get a tune, but I need to get rid of the stupid hesitation this bike has on the track, it scares the crap out of me and it still hasnt gone away. I have used the accel pump feature on the PC3 and it helped, but it is still there.

I think it's time I take out the STV's, I think there's a write up out there on it.

 

Dom, once you've ridden it without the Throttle Nannies you'll probably not go back. You'll find the throttle response can be dialed in well with the richness you choose at light throttles. Small openings give quite a bit of air....and can make quite a bit of power if you give it fuel, but too sensitive makes it hard to ride and if you play with it you'll find just that right level of power you like.

There is progress on the 'STV Eliminator' front too! We might have a working device soon...I hope. These darn computer bikes can be so fussy and do weird things...almost like they tried to sabotage us from tinkering. Ha...fat chance.

 

Rob, You have given me some great advice in the past but I have not yet had the guts to pull the STV butterflies. I got cold feet after reading not to do that in bold print in the shop manual but i'm nearly over it. Probably just Mama Suzuki wanting us to ride dull, I know, but that STV eliminator sure sounds interesting! BTW, while balancing the TB's, I found about 1/16" of play (normal?) in the linkage rods between the TV's and adjusted it out (not running) so that the TV's opened together but I lost one cylinder with an occasional soft backfire (poot!) which I am guessing was a very lean mix. When I re-balanced, I was back to the 1/16" play which opens the primary slightly sooner and may account for some vibration when on the throttle. I did not check the TPS until after the re-balance. Any thoughts?

 

So...when you're saying 'TV's' you're meaning the PRIMARY (main controlled by the throttle cables) throttles...yes? If so...you've got a problem as there shouldn't be ANY play in the linkages. Both are spring loaded to go closed, and the adjustment screws where you synch them held by springs too....so they should be tight and when you move the front cylinder the rear should follow immediately with no play.

If you're meaning the STV's...then some play (like the 1/16" you mention) is in the linkages on both my TB's here, so that would be normal. The motor to primary STV plate has some slop, then the front to rear links have a bit more so it isn't exactly precise as the primary throttles. I set mine by closing the front plate then measuring the distance from top of TB to the inboard edge...then matched that on the rear. Thinking being they restrict the air most when closed, so that is where they should be closest to the same...whether they both make it exactly perpendicular to flow when fully open less a consideration.

Reset the STVSensor once you're happy with the adjustments...and it wouldn't hurt to check the main synch too along with the TPS just to make sure everyone is happy. That STVSensor allows you to play with them a little bit and you can adjust their 'sensitivity' if you will. With the sensor set to one end of the spec. the plates will be closed a bit more than if you set it to the other end of spec. Setting them to be more open (but still in spec) will 'free up' the power a little and might make the engine feel better....it did on mine at least. Then I drilled the plates which 'freed it up' even more, them went Full Monty with them all the way out. It's all in how you want the throttle to deliver power....gently or aggressively.

 

So...when you're saying 'TV's' you're meaning the PRIMARY (main controlled by the throttle cables) throttles...yes? If so...you've got a problem as there shouldn't be ANY play in the linkages. Both are spring loaded to go closed, and the adjustment screws where you synch them held by springs too....so they should be tight and when you move the front cylinder the rear should follow immediately with no play.

If you're meaning the STV's...then some play (like the 1/16" you mention) is in the linkages on both my TB's here, so that would be normal. The motor to primary STV plate has some slop, then the front to rear links have a bit more so it isn't exactly precise as the primary throttles. I set mine by closing the front plate then measuring the distance from top of TB to the inboard edge...then matched that on the rear. Thinking being they restrict the air most when closed, so that is where they should be closest to the same...whether they both make it exactly perpendicular to flow when fully open less a consideration.

Reset the STVSensor once you're happy with the adjustments...and it wouldn't hurt to check the main synch too along with the TPS just to make sure everyone is happy. That STVSensor allows you to play with them a little bit and you can adjust their 'sensitivity' if you will. With the sensor set to one end of the spec. the plates will be closed a bit more than if you set it to the other end of spec. Setting them to be more open (but still in spec) will 'free up' the power a little and might make the engine feel better....it did on mine at least. Then I drilled the plates which 'freed it up' even more, them went Full Monty with them all the way out. It's all in how you want the throttle to deliver power....gently or aggressively.

Thanks again! Yes, I was asking about the linkage rod between the primary throttles. Knowing the play is abnormal, I have some more fiddling to do. The play is in the plastic bushing on the front end (secondary TV?) of the linkage rod, even though both TV's appear to spring closed as you described. Hard to imagine that bushing being worn under 13,000 miles, but may have to replace the linkage rod if nothing else shows up with a closer look. Any special tricks to removing the rod/bushings? Looks like a snap fit but I'm concerned about applying too much pressure during R&R.

Really like your suggestion of tuning the STV's on the open end of spec. and will have to try it after this little problem is sorted out---

Hope I'm not tugging too hard on your experience. You have been very generous with it in the past to me and many others, helping to make this the "go to" SV site. Also hope it all comes back to you in the best way.

Jim W.

 

OK....just looked at my spare TB's, and see what you are talking about on the throttle play. They DO have what you describe...so it should be normal for a little play in the bushings, but if you work the throttles like the cables operate them you'll (hopefully) see that there is NO slop as the closing springs hold them tightly together. I can make the bushings move by pulling on them, but the bike can't do this in operation. Just synch them properly and you'll be good to go. Hoping this is what you are concerned about and that it is the same on both of my TB's as you can buy the rods....but I'm thinking the new ones will be the same as you've got now.

This forum IS a good place to be. Helping one another is one of the great things about Motorcyclists as it seems bikers are a closer knit community than the car guys and more likely to help a friend out....at least it seems that way to me.

 

Many thanks (again)--- I must have over-adjusted the play out & cracked the front TV open a little causing that lean condition. With your info, I will do it all again & try not to screw up this time-----Jim W.

P.S.: Agree on the closer knit community.

 

Thanks gentlemen! I'm a little slow responding. But thanks!