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You can now buy a 'Glock in a box' without paperwork!

7K views 23 replies 10 participants last post by  60-80 
#1 ·
Yes...how silly is this!? For me to go to a store and buy a single shot .22lr pistol I have to fill out the 4473 Federal Firearms form as well as a second one for the State, then pay for a call to the Background Check and of course State Tax. Go a little deeper and you find you are also paying 11% Federal Tax on firearms so there's quite a chunk of change going out of your pocket to purchase a legal firearm in the USA.

Now....I just bought a Glock 17 (9mm with 17 round mags) through the mail from Midway USA, complete and it had NO Federal or State paperwork involved with it. Plus...NO SERIAL NUMBER! How can this be...you ask?

Enter the wonderful world of 80% fire arms my friend!:) Mine is made from a Polymer 80 frame (https://www.polymer80.com/) and has slide and barrel by Swenson along with factory Glock trigger and slide internals. Once it's finished the gun is fully functional and in some ways better than what Glock offers being as the grip frame comes in several color and texture options and it fits my hand much better. I like it!;)

But now...you're probably wondering why these 'Grey Guns' without serial numbers and bought through the mail off of the internet not being involved in mass gangland shootings? One of our Members over on a gun forum I frequent (and why my name is RecoilRob) works as a firearms examiner for a Police Dept. in LA, and he says that they haven't found a single 'Grey Gun' used in the commission of a crime.

The main reason is they're not completed and require some milling/drilling and fitting to become functional and legally this makes ME the 'manufacturer'. And let me tell you that doing that last 20% was a bit of a challenge and required some troubleshooting and fine adjustments to get it to run. What most gang-bangers do is either steal a good gun or buy something cheap with HighPoint leading the list being as they're not expensive and do seem to be reliable.

So I wasn't sure that anyone would be interested in something like this, but if you're up for a challenge and want to build a pistol....the Poly80 kits are pretty nice and if you do your work properly you end up with a totally functional Glock. Compared to buying one you can save about $100-150 depending on what sights/slide/barrel/trigger/ect you choose.

In case you were wondering...yes, I CAN sell the gun, but must put a serial number on it for sale. You can own a gun without the numbers, but it must have been made that way and if you have one where the original numbers have been removed...you will be in Heap Big Trouble. We can sell two guns a year without requiring a Manufacturers License, but that's not why I built it. Once it's proven to be reliable it's going to be my daily carry in the car being as it's quite a bit smaller and more handy than the 24/7 45 in use now. Just thought some of you bike guys/gals might find this interesting.:)
 
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#5 ·
Unless they have a search or arrest warrant, what would they be doing "finding" anything? You don't have to hand anything over for inspection besides registration and insurance during a routine traffic stop. What you described sounds like a wrongful arrest lawsuit, and violation of constitutional rights lawsuit, neither of which would end well for the offending cop/police department.

Regarding this topic, the fact that anyone with basic tool/machine knowledge can build whatever they want is nothing new. I'm not sure why it was posted in the manner it was... Every other sentence acts like people should be amazed or bewildered that this is "allowed." Last I checked, we lived in a free country, and building things at home is the backbone of innovation, and self sufficiency. Some asshat politician is not who I look to for advice on how to run my life.

It's a simple fact of life, creative and determined people can build anything they set their mind to. Rules and regulations will at best only slow them down a little.
 
#3 ·
There was an article in Wired Magazine a few years ago about Ghost Guns.

I think Ghost Guns are not much involved in crimes since folks who make them need to be fairly smart and have machining skill. Those characteristics, fairly orthogonal to shoot-em-up types. :ready:



Rob, how much to build one for me? :evil6: Can I have SN001?
 
#11 ·
Frank...I agree, we don't want to cause any undue stress to the Police Person. Here in PA we can open carry, but it seems to cause more problems than it's worth to me. Some people are almost guaranteed to call 911 and freak out because 'HE HAS A GUUUUNNN!!'

I've heard 911 calls where the operator asks 'well, what's he doing with it?' and the snowflake on the other end is crying all upset that anyone would be walking around with a gun. Some of them have embellished the call and by the time the responding Officer/s get the word it's been upgraded to something that sounds dangerous and they get all excited...which is the LAST thing we want. There have been several killings of legal carriers by over-excited Cops freaking out, so carrying concealed is the best option IMHO.

The only interactions I've had with Police when armed have gone smoothly and peacefully because I immediately told them I was carrying and not many criminal types will tell them up front like that....and they appreciate it. Then by being polite and seemingly in control of ones self goes a long way to lowering the stress levels.

You earlier asked about the lack of serial number on the pistol and how this would go down? It's clearly never been numbered and there is a plate for one in the stock location that Glock uses, so it is easy to see that the number hadn't been obliterated or altered and I think with 'Poly80' on the grip it would be pretty easy to explain how it came to be. Wouldn't expect them to believe me, but now with computers in each car he or she would be able to double-check the facts and would have no problems with it.

Our Carry Permits here don't have any weapon restrictions or numbers like some do...so if I can conceal it...I can carry it. Have actually ventured out with a PLR-16 KelTec under my coat hanging from its' strap around my shoulder. That is Bad Ass.:) I only did it because I was going to visit some friends and they got a real kick out of what I was carrying. Everyone there was packing and we were about the safest group of people around...despite what the snowflakes seem to think that if someone is armed they'll shoot somebody for any tiny reason. Somehow I think they may be projecting of what THEY would do and many Liberal Types seem to also be violent...especially when you disagree with them. Of course, they often cannot defend their position in an argument so anger and violence is their only recourse once they've lost the debate.:)
 
#12 ·
Yes. Both citizens and police can mistakenly (?) escalate an innocent situation into a deadly one based on mis-information and fear when a gun (even a toy gun) is involved. Michael Crawford and Tamir Rice are both dead because police jumped to wrong conclusions. Philando Castile had a permit to carry, and he's dead. if you choose to carry, you (ironically?) increase your odds of being shot by a cop. So, being as compliant and unthreatening as possible, even to the point of surrendering your firearm during the encounter, makes sense.
 
#16 ·
No....actually quite the opposite! Around here we're a very high percentage of concealed carriers and the goblins know this, so they're very choosy when picking their targets.

It's just amazing how potential thugs don't like it when you have a hand in a jacket pocket when they approach you...fearing that you might be holding a pistol. I've had this happen a couple times when out on walks with the girlfriend and they eyed us up by walked on by. The only real trick to this is to actually have a pistol in your hand and don't try faking it...that can be bad. They seem to have a 'sixth sense' about whether you're going to be able to shoot them or not. They may be criminals...but they're not stupid.;)
 
#19 ·
So this is unrelated to building firearms that don't have serial numbers, but I just saw a great documentary on amazon prime called Keep and Bear. It follows a Californian filmmaker, who had just moved to Idaho, along his path to being a gun owner. He starts out pro gun, but knowing literally nothing about firearms. It does a very good job portraying gun owners as normal everyday people and that guns are not a thing to be feared. It also does a great job at addressing and explaining some of the things gun owners have been saying for years during all these gun control debates with out making it political.

I recommend watching it and sharing with the people you know who are anti gun or who just don't know anything about guns.
 
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