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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
So,

I just landed my dream job and have some extra money to toy with.

Entertaining the idea of another bike. Leaving the SV for some track days and have something sporty for riding around town. Something with ABS seems like a must in the event that someone puts me in a 'situation' in which I grab the brake with all my might, I'd rather not front flip and get crushed. Something with a good amount of horsepower, but I'm not really into the idea of pulling the front wheel off of the ground, so some form of traction control sounds appropriate.

Are there any good 600cc supersport's that offer traction control and ABS? I know that Kawi has a good ABS system and you can get the ZX6R and Ninja650 with ABS, but don't think either are offered with traction control (please correct me if I am wrong).

S1000RR? Has both. Smart idea? Probably not. Tempting? :naughty:

I love the Triumph 675's, but I don't believe they have been available with ABS but I hear it is coming in 2013.

Would love to hear from some of you guys here.

Thanks

Justin
 

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Ducati is puting traction control and many of the new machines now, as well as many of the past models. Once again leading the way in motorbiking technology.

Have you considered the new 848SF, if you're into a naked bike?
The new 1199 also has DTC, even on the base model, if a more aggressive bike is your style.
 

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If you are pulling the wheel off the ground on a 600 cc bike unintentionally, you really need to check your throttle control and work on that. I have a GSX-R 750 and have never pulled the front wheel up. I wouldnt worry about the traction control if I were you. ABS is nice though and I wanted it if I could get it when I bought my current bike but the bike fit everything I was looking for so I went without ABS.
 

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You could buy a CBR600 with race ABS and add the traction control on your own with a Bazaaz system.
Bazzaz won't prevent wheelies. The Bazzaz monitors rate of change of acceleration of the rear wheel and cuts spark, if the rate of change exceeds set parameters. Most TC systems monitor the rear wheel and hence will not prevent wheelies. The Aprilia and BMW systems are the only systems that I can verify have actual wheelie control. They monitor both wheels and have gyros to monitor the bike's attitude.

I have the '12 S1000RR and can understand why it has wheelie control. If you crack the throttle open, it will lift the front - fast. (It can also be a ***** cat if you exercise good throttle control.) The wheelie control immediately activates and sets the wheel back down. The whole operation happens before you even realize the wheel lifted. If you stay on full throttle, the bike will pogo up and down.

I've only activated the ABS once. It was kinda scary. I was at the track working on braking points. I overshot my comfort zone and got on the brakes hard. I didn't lock the front, but lifted the rear - at about 150 mph. The ABS activated, released some pressure on the front brake and set the rear back down. But for a second or so, it felt like I lost my brakes.

Boltz, I'm a little hesitant recommending the S1000RR to you. Its better to learn how to avoid wheelies and locking the brakes with your own skills than to rely on electronic nannies. The nannies work so well that can mask really bad technique and that may get you in more trouble over the long run.

So, I'd recommend you get a bike without the nannies and learn to control wheelies and braking by developing good technique. Take the money you save and invest in some on track training. Besides that wheelies can be fun! Best of luck in whatever you decide to do.
 

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new Tuono.....


'course i'm a little biased!!! lolol
 

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I guess I skipped the part that he didn't want to wheelie under hard accel. I just read that he wanted TC. I know that the Bazaaz system and most others don't prevent wheelies. I agree with BRShooter, but I wouldn't mind having race ABS. I've never owned a bike with ABS, but I wouldn't mind if it did as long as it wasn't linked.
 

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To answer your questions, a CBR600RR w/ ABS is probably about as close as you will find currently.

As a comment, from your statements about unintentional wheelies and stoppies, it sounds like you would be better off investing some of the money from your dream job into rider education rather than a faster bike. ABS is wonderful in that it can give you a safety net while practicing your hard-braking skills. TC can help as well, but it can also teach you poor throttle control if you aren't paying attention.

For a few hundred dollars, you can put together a nice educational library of books and videos. For about $250-500, you can get professional training. Invest in yourself first, and the rewards will pay of on any/every motorcycle you ride.
 

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ABS only helps if you have the right technique, i.e. straight line/not leaned over.

You grab the front brake when your bars aren't 100% square and ABS won't help you anymore than non-ABS bikes.

I can understand the temptation to get a new bike, but should buy something that suits your riding style rather than what might sound cool.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Ducati is puting traction control and many of the new machines now, as well as many of the past models. Once again leading the way in motorbiking technology.

Have you considered the new 848SF, if you're into a naked bike?
The new 1199 also has DTC, even on the base model, if a more aggressive bike is your style.
848 Superbike is definitely on the do want list. No ABS though but the Corse model does have traction control.

Bazzaz won't prevent wheelies. The Bazzaz monitors rate of change of acceleration of the rear wheel and cuts spark, if the rate of change exceeds set parameters. Most TC systems monitor the rear wheel and hence will not prevent wheelies. The Aprilia and BMW systems are the only systems that I can verify have actual wheelie control. They monitor both wheels and have gyros to monitor the bike's attitude.

I have the '12 S1000RR and can understand why it has wheelie control. If you crack the throttle open, it will lift the front - fast. (It can also be a ***** cat if you exercise good throttle control.) The wheelie control immediately activates and sets the wheel back down. The whole operation happens before you even realize the wheel lifted. If you stay on full throttle, the bike will pogo up and down.

I've only activated the ABS once. It was kinda scary. I was at the track working on braking points. I overshot my comfort zone and got on the brakes hard. I didn't lock the front, but lifted the rear - at about 150 mph. The ABS activated, released some pressure on the front brake and set the rear back down. But for a second or so, it felt like I lost my brakes.

Boltz, I'm a little hesitant recommending the S1000RR to you. Its better to learn how to avoid wheelies and locking the brakes with your own skills than to rely on electronic nannies. The nannies work so well that can mask really bad technique and that may get you in more trouble over the long run.

So, I'd recommend you get a bike without the nannies and learn to control wheelies and braking by developing good technique. Take the money you save and invest in some on track training. Besides that wheelies can be fun! Best of luck in whatever you decide to do.
Thanks for the advice without mothering it up too much. I agree, I wouldn't recommend the S1000RR to myself either. Not that I couldn't deal with it, but it is a lot of bike. I also have read about the BMW abs and it seems what you experienced was in line with what the testers say.



To answer your questions, a CBR600RR w/ ABS is probably about as close as you will find currently.

As a comment, from your statements about unintentional wheelies and stoppies, it sounds like you would be better off investing some of the money from your dream job into rider education rather than a faster bike. ABS is wonderful in that it can give you a safety net while practicing your hard-braking skills. TC can help as well, but it can also teach you poor throttle control if you aren't paying attention.

For a few hundred dollars, you can put together a nice educational library of books and videos. For about $250-500, you can get professional training. Invest in yourself first, and the rewards will pay of on any/every motorcycle you ride.
I do have an MSF course under my belt from two years ago and am going to do the advanced rider class next spring. Also have some track days coming up which will be with the SV.

I have a lot of friends with 20-40 years of riding experience whom I ride with and try to learn from regularly. I understand the physics of motorcycling and have a lot of car racing under my belt. I am used to very fast cars and understand how to respect power and pick and choose your spots to have fun.

Now this isn't to say that I am some super squid that can handle anything or anything egotistical like that, I just want to note that I am drinking deep from the pool of knowledge and intensely and continually investing into my own skill set so that I can become the best rider that I can be. Just like how I am with cars.

I would like ABS because even though many experienced riders will 'scoff' at it, all the hard facts show you are going to be safer with it than not. Also, I don't want TC so that I can keep the throttle pegged and indulge in *******ery, but use it as an aide while learning to handle the new found power.

ABS only helps if you have the right technique, i.e. straight line/not leaned over.

You grab the front brake when your bars aren't 100% square and ABS won't help you anymore than non-ABS bikes.

I can understand the temptation to get a new bike, but should buy something that suits your riding style rather than what might sound cool.
I appreciate that. There are conditions where ABS won't do a thing for you, but there are also many situations where you will be better off than not.



Guys, thanks for the input thus far. It is much appreciated. I take getting a bigger bike very seriously and understand that there are inherent dangers. I don't want electronic aides to manage everything for me so that I can be a fool, but rather for a bit of assistance when necessary. I don't PLAN to try and pull wheelies all day or to be doing emergency braking procedures regularly. I however do realize that those features have been developed for a reason and they are good to have when stepping up to a bigger bike.

I am here to learn and don't want to rub off as someone who wants to ask the same questions until someone tells them the answer they want to hear. That behavior really annoys me.

I am thankful for the kind advice so far and please know that I do invest in my continuing education and improvement of skill set.

Thanks

Justin
 

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I've had the chance to ride a couple of "big bikes" ('08 Z1000 and '02 954RR) and really, the traction control is in your right hand.

Just knowing I was on something fiercer made me more cautious, and I therefore slowly built up my comfort with the throttle. I didn't go whacking it like you might be able to on a 600 or SV.
 

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Good response, it looks like you have a general sense of what you're after and how to control it.

So far it looks like the S1000RR fits the bill. Very tempting, but fits all your critera.

Any idea if the new Ninja 1000 has TC? Most new bikes now offer ABS, but TC is still limited to certain bikes.

You might be looking at Euro mnfg's in this case, mainly Ducati or BMW
 

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I have a GSX-R 750 and have never pulled the front wheel up.
:gay:

If you ever hit WOT in 1st gear, that front wheel is coming up. Even with the stock gearing the front end should float.

On to the topic...

I'm sure it's already been said but not all traction control systems have anti-wheelie. As far as I know only the BMW and Aprilia do.
 

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I have TC and ABS on my 2012 Ducati Monster 1100 EVO and honestly, I think the TC is too intrusive so I just leave it turned off. I've ridden it in the rain and never felt the need to turn on DTC. Plus, I love that feel when the front end lifts up under a reasonably hard launch. ;D

ABS defaults to on every time you start the bike and I'm happy with that system so I leave it alone. I've only experienced ABS start to kick in maybe two or three times in the 8,000 miles I've put on it.

I think ABS is a great feature on a street ridden motorcycle. There are just too many variables on the street. No reason every bike shouldn't have it IMO.

By the way, someone mentioned the 848 Streetfighter. That is a fantastic bike and a lot of fun to ride, I've ridden it a couple times, but ABS is not even an option on that bike. My bike came with both as standard equipment.

I'm curious, how many years/miles riding experience do you have? I've ridden some pretty fast bikes and nothing really intimidates me anymore. Still, you have to respect the power.
 
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