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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Just a quick question. Do the 04-05 gsxr 600/750's have a radial master cylinder up front? I know they have radial brakes, but so do the 05 600rr and they got a regular master cylinder. Thanks guys!

I just got a 1000rr front end and looking to get the gixxer clip/ons controls cause my bike has a cable clutch (1000rr is hydraulic) and cause they are pretty abundant and cheap as shite. BTW, its all going on an f2
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
sweeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeet!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 

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i think you can run the stock sv master with radials, but you wont get all the radials have to offer. i may be wrong, but i think running the stock sv master with non radial, like 01-03 gsxr?? will work fine
 

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The only thing that makes a difference is the bore diameter and the lever geometry. In general a larger bore will give less travel, more feel. Smaller bore will give longer travel, less feel. The arrangement of the bore (as in "radial" master cylinders) means nothing. I am something of an expert in hydraulics and this I know for a fact.

In fact "radial" brakes on motorcycles are not possible. True radial brakes have the mounts for the calipers on the same plane with the rotors. There is always a torque arm between the rotor and the forks, so radial brakes, as sold today, are not true radials.

I've designed brake systems up to 70,000 HP, so I kind of know this stuff.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
andyauger said:
The only thing that makes a difference is the bore diameter and the lever geometry.  In general a larger bore will give less travel, more feel.  Smaller bore will give longer travel, less feel.  The arrangement of the bore (as in "radial" master cylinders) means nothing. 
To an extend, that is ture.  But, what I found out when researching this, from a bunch of racers and from a few other members from various forums (who I consider to be very knowledgeable) is that the key difference in a radial master cylinder and a traditional master cylinder it the way it is positioned.  I'll try to find the pics that someone posted up to show the differenc, but that will have to wait for later. 

Yes, it is true you can use a regular master cylinder with radial brakes, but you will not get all the radial brakes have to offer.  Also, I have heard you can use a radial master cylinder with standard brakes, and it has a better "feel". 

I'm not trying to discredit your statement, because it is absolutely true that all a master cylinder is, is a fluid mover.  But, radial master cylinders are configured differently and provide better feel and more stopping power with less effort, and are supposed to be more progressive feeling as well.  Mind you, this is what I have heard, I have yet to install my new brakes and front end, but this came from a bunch of racers from a couple different boards, and a few guys from another board that I consider to be very knowledgeable.

edit: found pics myself

radial master cylinder:


traditional master cylinder:
 

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IMO the big, real world difference is that most radial m/cs are better built than most traditional m/cs. Look at the brembo in the pic there... The lever adjustment method helps to remove flex and play from the lever itself (by comparison, the SV one has a fold in the middle- the Brembo one is a single piece, it's the actual cylinder actuator rod that changes length) and it has an integral bleed nipple, which you don't know you want till you've got one, then you never want one without it ever again. And what I personalyl love with the Brembo is the under-cylinder banjo mounting- wheresa on the SV the banjo bolt creates a high-point, the Brembo has the lines bolt in from underneath. It's not only neater and easier on the eye, it also eradicates that irritating bubble point.

There are traditional m/cs out there that are very very good, of course- there's nothing in what i wrote above htat couldn't be applied to a traditional one. But they're less common. You'd think recent GSXRs would have good m/cs, wouldn't you? But right up until they went radial you could still find hte same item as was on the SV on some models.
 

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I stick with what I said. The only reason you call a radial master cylinder a radial master cylinder is because of the arrangement of the plunger. There is no difference in feel or function. I would take a Brembo "regular" master over any OEM radial because of the other thing mentioned, build quality. When designing hydraulic actuators the only considerations in arrangement are available space, simplicity of build and ease of maintenance. Nothing else matters.
 

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Absolutely. But development on trditinal cylinders has now pretty much stopped. The Brembos for sale in the usual range are older designs, all predating the earliest of their radials.

A Brembo traditional m/c might very well be better than a GSXR radial- but they're also harder to find, usually more expensive, and more expensive to get replaement parts for. If you're going to that length, why not go with the better options that Brembo now produce? I agree that they're not better because they're radial, but they're more evolved designs. My own Brembo radial was bought used for less than the older ones usually sell for, since they're in demand as replacement parts.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Yeah, I would take a traditional brembo over a stock radial anyday,! I just used that pic cause it was the first one i found, but I wasnt trying to compare brembo to a stock, I was just trying to illustrate the positon of the radial m/c compared to a traditional m/c. Comparing apples to apples, I was told that a radial m/c provides better feel and more progressive action than a traditional m/c of the same build and quality.

Just a bit of info, every site I went to that sells brembo, only offers the radial m/c's now. No brembo traditionals were to be found. I think thats just cause thats where the industry is pushing it.

Another piece of info, the new R1's have radial m/c's built by Brembo, and they are becoming a popular mod with GSXR racers and some SV guys as well. Supposed to be really nice!
 

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cbrf23 said:
Another piece of info, the new R1's have radial m/c's built by Brembo, and they are becoming a popular mod with GSXR racers and some SV guys as well.  Supposed to be really nice!
yea I have a R6 radial brembo for my gsxr front end Waiting for parts and good weather to try it out.
 

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LmtdSlip said:
Are the inner diameters of the brake line banjo fittings a standard size so that these other brands will bolt up with the stock line?

Does this apply to the first gen bikes as well?
The R6 and the SV banjos were the same thread pitch but my gsxr MC was not the same thread pitch.
 
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