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Discussion Starter #1
http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20090325/us_nm/us_fighter_crash_usa_1
"WASHINGTON (Reuters) – A U.S. Air Force F-22 fighter, designed to be the world's top air-superiority aircraft, crashed Wednesday near Edwards Air Force Base, California, while on a test mission, an Air Force official said.

The Lockheed Martin Corp -built F-22 went down about 10 a.m. Central Time about 35 miles northeast of Edwards, where it had been based, said Maj. Michelle Coghill, a spokeswoman for the Air Combat Command.

"It was a test mission," she said, citing preliminary information. She said the condition of the lone pilot was not immediately known. An investigation would take place, Coghill said.

(Reporting by Jim Wolf; editing by Gerald E. McCormick)"

This better not effect my track day at Willow this weekend lol, hope the pilot made it out ok
 

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That will be expensive...
 

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is there any reason why such an expensive and advanced aircraft doesn't have some sort of automatic recovery system if a pilot ejects? I'm thinking auto pilot deploys air brakes, and releases some sort of parachute system?
 

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is there any reason why such an expensive and advanced aircraft doesn't have some sort of automatic recovery system if a pilot ejects? I'm thinking auto pilot deploys air brakes, and releases some sort of parachute system?
Yup. Weight and cost. If the plane had all of that, than why have a pilot?
 

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There are so many electronic systems on those things it's hard to keep them all working perfectly. They're advanced and that's great, but high g's and acceleration can do a hell of a number on (somewhat) delicate electronics. It's also hard that these planes are babies compared to the rest of our fleet so they're far from having all the kinks hammered out.

I always though it was a trip watching the armament troops load a missile on one, then plug in a laptop to it just to let the plane know it was attached and armed.
 

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regarding a recovery system: if your brand new, high tech, top secret jet is going to crash anywhere near enemy territory, I suspect you'd ideally prefer it a pile of molten metal then a rosetta stone .
 

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Discussion Starter #8
regarding a recovery system: if your brand new, high tech, top secret jet is going to crash anywhere near enemy territory, I suspect you'd ideally prefer it a pile of molten metal then a rosetta stone .
well put :lol:
you definitely don't want another stealth aircraft in enemy territory

One F-117 has been lost in combat, to the Yugoslav Army. On 27 March 1999, during the Kosovo War, the 3rd Battalion of the 250th Air Defence Missile Brigade under the command of Colonel Zoltán Dani[34], equipped with the Isayev S-125 'Neva' (NATO designation SA-3 'Goa') anti-aircraft missile system, downed a F-117A callsign "Vega 31," AF Serial Number 82-0806, with a Serbian improved Neva-M missile.[35][36] According to NATO Commander Wesley Clark and other NATO generals, Yugoslav air defences detected F-117s by operating their radars on unusually long wavelengths, making them visible to radar for brief periods.

Reportedly, several SA-3s were launched from approximately 8 miles out, one of which detonated in close proximity to the F-117A, forcing the pilot to eject. Though still classified, it is believed that the F-117 has no radar warning indicator, so the pilot's first indication of an incoming missile was likely seeing its flame. At this distance and combined speed the pilot had about 6 seconds to react before impact. According to an interview, Zoltán Dani kept most of his missile sites intact by frequently moving them, and had spotters looking for F-117s and other NATO aircraft. He personally supervised the modification of his targeting radar to increase its wavelength. The commanders and crews of the SAMs guessed the flight paths of earlier F-117A strikes from rare radar spotting and positioned their SAM launchers and spotters accordingly. It is believed that the SA-3 crews and spotters were able to locate and track F-117A 82-806 visually, probably with infra-red and night vision systems. He claimed that his battery shot down an F-16 as well.

The F-117 pilot survived and was later rescued by U.S. Air Force Pararescue personnel. The wreckage of the F-117 was not promptly bombed, due to possible media fallout from news footage of civilians around the wreckage. The Serbs are believed to have invited Russian personnel to inspect the remains, compromising the then 25-year old U.S. stealth technology.[37] The remains are displayed at the Museum of Aviation in Belgrade close to Belgrade Nikola Tesla Airport. An error was made by many about the pilot's identity. While the name "Capt Ken 'Wiz' Dwelle" was painted on the canopy, it was revealed in 2007 that the pilot was Lt Col Dale Zelko, USAF.[38][39]

Some American sources acknowledge that a second F-117A was damaged during the same campaign, and although returned to base, it supposedly never flew again.
 

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is there any reason why such an expensive and advanced aircraft doesn't have some sort of automatic recovery system if a pilot ejects? I'm thinking auto pilot deploys air brakes, and releases some sort of parachute system?
I believe it will recover itself when you pull so many Gs and you blackout.
 

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I believe it will recover itself when you pull so many Gs and you blackout.
It will return to flying in a straight line, but doesn't exactly fix your position relative to the horizon. If you're pointed down you're going to wake up one unhappy camper. Besides blacking out at high g's is for p*ssys.
 

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Sad. Usually, the pilots will do everything they can to save the plane up to a point, then it's time to punch out. Yeah, $150 million is expensive, but the pilot going down with the plane just adds immeasurable cost to an already expensive accident.

EDIT: On a related note, I saw a news item this morning that the first test flight of an F-35 by a Marine pilot was just conducted (maybe yesterday).
 

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Sad. Usually, the pilots will do everything they can to save the plane up to a point, then it's time to punch out. Yeah, $150 million is expensive, but the pilot going down with the plane just adds immeasurable cost to an already expensive accident.

EDIT: On a related note, I saw a news item this morning that the first test flight of an F-35 by a Marine pilot was just conducted (maybe yesterday).
Good point, hence the push for UAV's. If it gets shot down or malfunctions we only lose money, not a life.

Very cool about the F-35. Although the Marines get the nice VTOL model which the AF decided was unnecessary for our purposes (mostly donut runs).
 

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well put :lol:
you definitely don't want another stealth aircraft in enemy territory
Yeah but that is first generation stealth...no body cares about that dated POS :p. it's old hat compared to the F22 ;D. Pinto to GT40 comparison
 

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DieTrying310 said:
Very cool about the F-35. Although the Marines get the nice VTOL model which the AF decided was unnecessary for our purposes (mostly donut runs).
That's sort of a mission/tradition thing. We still like to see a multi-bazillion dollar plane landing at the intersection of two dirt roads. Don't know why, but it gives us a chubby.
 

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Show offs. ;)

Although guided missiles and Mach 2.5+ gives us a good stiff one, so to each his own I guess.
 

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Discussion Starter #16
Yeah but that is first generation stealth...no body cares about that dated POS :p. it's old hat compared to the F22 ;D. Pinto to GT40 comparison
that is 100% correct, in fact the F-117 now reside in a bone yard, not gonna fly ever again...not a huge loss
 

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Discussion Starter #17
That's sort of a mission/tradition thing. We still like to see a multi-bazillion dollar plane landing at the intersection of two dirt roads. Don't know why, but it gives us a chubby.
like in True Lies
"You're Fired" :lmao: Arnold quotes are the best!
 

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Good point, hence the push for UAV's. If it gets shot down or malfunctions we only lose money, not a life.

Very cool about the F-35. Although the Marines get the nice VTOL model which the AF decided was unnecessary for our purposes (mostly donut runs).
I think the VTOL version is awesome! But the AF with be it's usual lame self. so instead of the fan in the middle it's going to be another fuel tank...So it will be a souped up F-16!
 

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Discussion Starter #19
I think the VTOL version is awesome! But the AF with be it's usual lame self. so instead of the fan in the middle it's going to be another fuel tank...So it will be a souped up F-16!
why the hell would the AF want a VTOL aircraft, they have runways, not boats, and VTOL takes so much fuel the marines don't even use it unless they have to, they do a much slower than convential landing on runways, but not the fuel sucking vertical landings
 
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