[billbillw]

I changed out my fork springs and put new oil in today. Everything was going fine. Disassembly went quick, dumped oil, cut new spacers, measured oil levels, put everything back together and went to put the wheel back on and found a little surprise. When I checked the shop manual, it only shows two spacers, the axle, and the speedo sensor. Mine had the two spacers, two large washers (about 1mm thick), the axle and the speedo sensor. Hmm.

I remember one of the washers was placed between the two spacers on the right side when I took it out, but I couldn't really remember where the other one was. It seemed like it was on the left speedo side, but it didn't want to fit properly when I tried to put it back.

I went inside and looked back at some photos and sure enough, one of the washers was previously between the speedo sensor and the fork body. When I tried to do it, the washer bumped into the little tab that is supposed to hold the speedo sensor from rotating forward. I tried without the washers and it seemed like there was too much play without them. I probably could have torqued the bolt down but I didn't want to have the forks bending inward.

I tried with just one, but it seemed like things weren't quite aligned.

I ended up filing down the left washer to fit under the speedo stop tab and put it back together in the order it was previously. Everything seems to be centered and the brake calipers are not binding or anything.

I just can't get past the feeling that something is not right. Possibly the previous owner replaced the wheel with one that was close, but slightly narrower? Not really sure.

Anyone have any ideas?

Right side photo:

Left side (speedo sensor) photo:

Here is a photo of the bike showing the front pretty well. Everything looks stock to me. Anyone see anything that is off?

 

[RichDesmond]

The PO screwed up. You shouldn't have either washer there.
What had "too much play"?? One thing to be aware of is that the shoulder of the axle on the right (nut) side does not contact the fork leg if everything is installed correctly. There's a 1-2mm gap. If you've never seen it before it definitely looks funny, and may have prompted the PO to stick the washers in there.

 

[billbillw]

The PO screwed up. You shouldn't have either washer there.
What had "too much play"?? One thing to be aware of is that the shoulder of the axle on the right (nut) side does not contact the fork leg if everything is installed correctly. There's a 1-2mm gap. If you've never seen it before it definitely looks funny, and may have prompted the PO to stick the washers in there.

I don't get how there could be a gap...The inner spacer needs to be firm against the wheel assembly to keep the bearings dry, right? Without that washer in there, it would just float. That is, unless you are supposed to push the outer spacer until it meets the inner spacer? Does anyone have a photo of how it is supposed to look?

I think something is not right. Either one of my spacers is too short, or the width of my wheel innards is too narrow.

 

[billbillw]

Maybe I should clarify. When I said there was too much play, I meant that the speedo sensor wasn't touching the left fork, and the right side dust cap wasn't firmly pressed against the bearing.

 

[RichDesmond]

I don't get how there could be a gap...The inner spacer needs to be firm against the wheel assembly to keep the bearings dry, right? Without that washer in there, it would just float. That is, unless you are supposed to push the outer spacer until it meets the inner spacer? Does anyone have a photo of how it is supposed to look?

I think something is not right. Either one of my spacers is too short, or the width of my wheel innards is too narrow.

The gap isn't between any of those parts, it's between the shoulder of the axle and the outside of the right fork leg. As you tighten the axle the speedo drive, wheel bearings, flanged spacer and plain spacer (in that order from left to right) should snug up against each other and the left fork leg. The right fork leg floats on the plain spacer. Make sure that you have the pinch bolt loosened and that the plain spacer isn't frozen into the right fork leg. It should slide smoothly through that hole.

 

[billbillw]

The gap isn't between any of those parts, it's between the shoulder of the axle and the outside of the right fork leg. As you tighten the axle the speedo drive, wheel bearings, flanged spacer and plain spacer (in that order from left to right) should snug up against each other and the left fork leg. The right fork leg floats on the plain spacer. Make sure that you have the pich bolt loosened and that the plain spacer isn't frozen into the right fork leg. It should slide smoothly through that hole.

Will it seem like the forks need to be pulled together? I'll go back and try it again without the washers, but it seems to me that adding the 2 washers (approx 1mm each) would make the shoulder stick out even further, but on mine, it doesn't stick out at all. It is flush. The plain spacer was free to move when I did all this.

Were there any other bikes that had similar front wheels that people would swap out in a pinch? Like, if they wrecked the original? Perhaps the PO swapped wheels with something that had a narrower wheel hub? I just don't know at this point...

 

[RichDesmond]

Your wheel looks like a stock SV wheel.

The fork legs don't get pulled together, as I said the right leg floats on the plain spacer. Make sure that spacer isn't frozen in place.

 

[billbillw]

Your wheel looks like a stock SV wheel.

The fork legs don't get pulled together, as I said the right leg floats on the plain spacer. Make sure that spacer isn't frozen in place.

The spacer was completely free to float. It just doesn't fit like you say. There is just something not quite right about mine.

I'm just not going to worry about it. With the washers in, everything seems to fit. Brakes line up. Wheel is centered. It goes down the road straight, no wobbles or pulls, handles great. It might just remain a mystery that one of the previous owners will know the answer too. I'm at least the 3rd owner and I didn't get to grill the last owner much about it.

 

[D'Ecosse]

... There is just something not quite right about mine. .....

Yeah - there's a couple of washers in there that shouldn't be!

...The fork legs don't get pulled together, as I said the right leg floats on the plain spacer. ....

:iamwithstupid:

There should be no washers - the one on the left will definitely offset your wheel by the thickness of the washer. The right one makes no difference either way.

Here's how it works - wheel aligns off the left fork leg ONLY. The axle being tightened brings the two right spacers, the wheel, the speedo drive and the left fork leg into compression; the spacing on the left side (the speedo sensor) is what actually references the wheel to the left leg to 'center' it.
Here's the understanding you're missing - the right leg is not part of the equation at all - as Rich says, the axle is tightened to the first spacer but completely 'free' with respect to the right fork leg; the last part of the process is to tighten down on the fork leg pinch bolts.
That is why the right side washer actually makes no difference in the scheme of things (although it shouldn't be there!); the axle bolt is tightening against that first spacer, not the fork leg. You could make put three washers on that right side and it would make no differerence to the wheel alignment - it will just push the axle further out from the right fork leg. (in fact if you do that, you can demonstrate for yourself how that right leg works in the grand scheme of things)
Again however - the LEFT washer DOES impact the wheel centering.

Get them out of there!

 

[billbillw]

What you guys are not understanding is that it won't tighten down without the washers! I don't know how to explain it any other way.

I understand how it should be, but something in my wheel or the spacers is not standard. I'll take out the left washer and put it on the right and see how things are, but without the washers, the axle bolt is bottomed out on the right fork leg before things are tight. It leaves slop in the speedo sensor and in the bearing dust cover.

 

[D'Ecosse]

Are your forks possibly tweaked?
Loosen up your triple clamps & see what happens as you put it together without the washers.

 

[billbillw]

Are your forks possibly tweaked?
Loosen up your triple clamps & see what happens as you put it together without the washers.

I had the forks off yesterday. They seemed straight and true. They went in and out of the triples perfect. The fender mounts perfectly. The axle bolt lines up perfect (aside from the spacer issue). I see nothing to indicate they are bent in any way.

Does anyone have a length measurement for the plain spacer and the dust cap spacer? I'm thinking that one or both of mine are too short.

 

[D'Ecosse]

Is it possible you have a Gen 2 wheel?
I'm not sure of the exact difference in the bearing spacer dimension, only that it's different between the two.

 

[billbillw]

Is it possible you have a Gen 2 wheel?
I'm not sure of the exact difference in the bearing spacer dimension, only that it's different between the two.

As I've said, I'm at least the 3rd owner, so anything is possible. How many Suzuki wheels were silver and looked the same as the 1st gen SV?

 

[RichDesmond]

I had the forks off yesterday. They seemed straight and true. They went in and out of the triples perfect. The fender mounts perfectly. The axle bolt lines up perfect (aside from the spacer issue). I see nothing to indicate they are bent in any way.

Does anyone have a length measurement for the plain spacer and the dust cap spacer? I'm thinking that one or both of mine are too short.

Plain spacer is ~48mm, inner spacer is 26mm. I'd also pull the wheel and make sure there's a spacer between the bearing.

Bandit 600 and second gen Katana 600 wheels wheel were very similar IIRC. Back in the early days of the SV is was common for racers to use those for extra wheels. I can't remember though if they were straight bolt ups or if we had to fab spacers. Second gen SV wheels require some work to make them fit, spacers and bearings since the axle is bigger.

 

[billbillw]

Thanks Rich. I'll take things apart and measure over the weekend. I know there is a spacer between the bearings because I looked when I had the wheel off.