Suzuki SV650 Riders Forum banner

1 - 20 of 25 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
101 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Pre-story note: this is my first bike, and I've ridden it for a little over a week.

Just got my front tire replaced at a local shop. The previous tire was well past the wear indicator. The back tire needs to be replaced soon as well, but don't have money for that just yet. It can go a bit longer.

The shop owner tells me that my back tire was terribly underinflated, like 15 psi. Yes, I should've checked and filled before, but all done. It's filled now.

So I take the bike out for a bit, around a high school lot not far from here, and holy crap this thing is so much more responsive. The slightest little touch causes it to respond, whereas before I felt...well, more in control. Like I was making it lean. I putzed around and got used to that a bit, but the lean-out feels slower. Before, it seemed like the bike would easily lean-out of the turn, now it seems like it wants to stay in the turn longer.

I know "riding more" will help to shake the difference, but why does it seem so drastic? ("Because your tire was underinflated" is not a helpful answer). Is it supposed to be like that, and I just got used to it? The MSF 125's feel more like what it was before, but maybe the extra 425cc make that difference?
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
418 Posts
partially with a new front tire and yes more rear pressure. when mine was down to 20 ish psi it felt slow and slugish on turn in. but with proper pressure it made a world of difference.


and be gentle on that new front tire till the cosmoline wears off. its super slick and you push it to much you might meet the asphalt
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
818 Posts
As to new tires being slick, it is a good idea to scrub a new tire with dish soap and a bristle (plastic) brush then rinse thoroughly.

Your not liking "underinflated tires are like that" as an answer does not change the fact. Hopefully, buy fully inflated, you mean 33/36 and not 42/42. Once you ride a little more, you will understand better the effects of over- and under- inflation.

May I suggest David L Hough's Proficient Motorcycling as a good start to your rider education library of learning?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
101 Posts
Discussion Starter · #5 ·
May I suggest David L Hough's Proficient Motorcycling as a good start to your rider education library of learning?
Birthday is next month and it's on my list!

Yeah, the guy suggested 36/36 and filled it so.
 

·
MOTORADOR
Joined
·
10,954 Posts
The profile of the tire has a lot to do too.

Old squared front tire + old squared underinflated rear tire = The bike wants to stand up and stay up.

New tires, intact rounded profile = The bike loves to lean... but still, with better, fresher rubber, you are more in control and the bike will go exactly wherever you ask her to go.

And yes, get more miles. Practice, practice, practice, and add the "Twist of the Wrist II" video and the "Total Control" book to your birthday list... you will love them.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,135 Posts
As to new tires being slick, it is a good idea to scrub a new tire with dish soap and a bristle (plastic) brush then rinse thoroughly
Ride & read more, post less.
I go through 6-7 sets of tires a year. Never done this in my life & don't know anyone who has. Put tires on & ride the frikkin thing.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,135 Posts
I know "riding more" will help to shake the difference, but why does it seem so drastic? ("Because your tire was underinflated" is not a helpful answer). Is it supposed to be like that, and I just got used to it? The MSF 125's feel more like what it was before, but maybe the extra 425cc make that difference?
Because your tire was underinflated ;).... The tire was basically flat, which makes it difficult to lean. With a properly inflated tire, the tire will hold its shape much more, thus making it far easier to lean over.

And the handling characteristics have very little to do with the displacement. It's a function of frame geometry, suspension, weight, blah blah blah. A bike that handles well will fall into the turns easily and be stable in the turn, requiring little effort to keep it leaned and in the turn.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
101 Posts
Discussion Starter · #10 ·
Riding home and then back to work this morning, it felt much better. Guess I just had the initial shock of the difference of what it's supposed to be.

So I should RTFM instead of listen to the tire guy? He said something about how it's supposed to be 33 (which I knew from manual), but because I'm "a bigger guy" (220 lbs), he made it 36. I can let some out if you all think that's best. I just assumed he knew his stuff since all he does is tires.

Twist of the Wrist video was really good - I caught it on YT. The book would be good to have around, though.

Biggest item on birthday list: saddlebags. I commute, and having a backpack keeps the air from leaving my jacket efficiently. Georgia summer is coming!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,135 Posts
Anywhere between 33 and 40 is fine. Adjust tire pressure according to what you want to accomplish.

More traction = lower pressures (in the 30psi neighborhood).
More mileage = higher pressures (up to the 40psi neighborhood).

For a good balance of both, somewhere around 34-36psi for your average sized street bike & rider.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
55 Posts
When I got my SV650 last year this month, it came with some pretty used Dunlop Sportmax (I think) tires that had a date on them from like 2008. Besides how old they are, I prob could have gotten a few more months out of them this year had it not been for my battery box sagging and hitting the rear tire (which I also have fixed).

Anyways, I knew I was going to have to get new tires this year. Between the age and damage done, it had to be done. I had little confidence in the tires, especially in turns. Didn't feel like it leaned into and out of turns right.

Just got new front and rear tires last week, Pirelli Angels. I just have to say worlds difference. Like night and day, like riding a totally different bike. They go into and out of corners so amazing. And I feel like I am feeling everything that is going on so much more.

I put 100 miles on them before I started getting more agressive, not that my driving style is agressive as it is LOL.
 

·
Safety Adviser
Joined
·
879 Posts
Because your tire was underinflated ;).... The tire was basically flat, which makes it difficult to lean. With a properly inflated tire, the tire will hold its shape much more, thus making it far easier to lean over.

And the handling characteristics have very little to do with the displacement. It's a function of frame geometry, suspension, weight, blah blah blah. A bike that handles well will fall into the turns easily and be stable in the turn, requiring little effort to keep it leaned and in the turn.
+2
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
686 Posts
Ride & read more, post less.
I go through 6-7 sets of tires a year. Never done this in my life & don't know anyone who has. Put tires on & ride the frikkin thing.
Also a first for me, hearing about the dish-soap thing. :lmao:

We tell our customers to take it easy for the first 50 miles, just to be safe.

Personally, I think more people bin it on new tires because of the increased profile, more than mold release, but that's just me. But taking it easy for the first few miles will solve either problem. :thumbsup:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,135 Posts
I think you'll be hard pressed to find many manufacturers that use mold release in their tire molds nowadays.... even harder to find a manufacturer that ships their tires out with the release agent still on the tire.

I can't remember the last time I even heard those words mentioned by a tire representative. The only people I hear talking about it are people who aren't in the industry.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,773 Posts
and be gentle on that new front tire till the cosmoline wears off. its super slick and you push it to much you might meet the asphalt
There is no cosmoline on his tire, that is what guns are packed in, and as far as I know it was never used to pack motorcycle tires.

Most tire manufacturers don't even use mold release anymore and haven't for years, the technology of the rubber and the molds has made it unnecessary. These days it only exists as an excuse for inexperienced riders to blame wrecks on.

I agree with Oreo, just ride the bike and stop putting things in your head to worry about. I've never pre-scrubbed a tire with sandpaper, soap, or anything else and have never had an issue, even when leaving the shop on new tires in a rainstorm. I'm sure some of the racers on here have pics of guys lined up to start races who didn't even bother to remove the stickers from the treads.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,743 Posts
Most tire manufacturers don't even use mold release anymore and haven't for years,
I highly doubt this. Go to a shop with new tires and rub your fingers on them. They feel greasy. That's the release compound, and it's still used.


That being said. It's not as big of a deal as everyone says. Take it easy for the first chunk of miles and eveything will be hunky-dory.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,773 Posts
I highly doubt this. Go to a shop with new tires and rub your fingers on them. They feel greasy. That's the release compound, and it's still used.


That being said. It's not as big of a deal as everyone says. Take it easy for the first chunk of miles and eveything will be hunky-dory.
Metzeler disagrees with you
Hello Thanks for the questions. There are common mis-conceptions about tires that never seem to go away. Let us explain the details in the following method.

Metzeler tires are manufactured with very modern methods and without mold release. It is critical to understand that the appearance of the tire and mold surface have a important relationship. Customers love to look and touch tires and the tires must be visually appealing. To make this happen the mold surface is polished and is very smooth so the tire's surface is the same. So clearly this type of mold surface (and a shot of steam) helps the tire release from the mold at the end of it's curing cycle and mold release is not needed.

Tires are made from 20 or so petroleum based chemicals along with steel for the beads (and tread belts in some products) and various fabrics like rayon, nylon, Kevlar, and polyester to make a tire. Compounds are formulated to do the various jobs needed. For instance the tubeless tire's inner liner compound is there to prevent the tire from leaking air thru the carcass. The tread compound is very different from this liner compound and the sidewall compound as it must grip the road, give chemical wet grip, provide less rolling resistance to give mileage. To get these exactly as the R&D engineer wants them to be the tire is baked in a oven to change the molecular structure to the required product. These curing ovens use a heat between 300 to 500 degrees F for around 10 to 30 minutes (trade secret, sorry) to vulcanize the tire as it was designed. This means that once the tire leaves the mold it is finished and no curing is done by the rider.

The idea of the breaking in a new tire is as follows. First is that after the install the tire will move ever so slightly on the rim to seat itself in the first few miles. The break in procedure we suggest is somewhere between 3 corners of the first lap for a race tire on a race track to about 300 miles for a touring tire. Why? Well the extreme forces generated to the soft race compound tire by a expert rider will break in the tire in the first few corners of the race track. Then on the other end you we have a rider on a BMW K1200 LT riding on public roads at legal speeds gently scrubbing in the tires over the 300 or so miles of use. Now let's talk about scrubbing. When the tire is new the very sharp edges of the tread grooves combined with the tire's smooth surface GIVE the impression of a slippery tire, but that is not the case. This new tire is sensitive to the various bumps, grooves, holes of the pavement and this sensitivity is what is the so called slippery feeling. So as you can see the point of the break in a tire is to help the rider get used to a new (non worn out) quicker and better handling tire at a easy pace and to knock off the sharp edges and scuff the tread blocks.

When speaking of warm up then one must remember that any street tire needs about 2 to 5 miles to get up to proper temperature to work properly and give maximum handling to the rider. This amount of time will of course change depending on the ambient temperature, we hope this helps answer your questions and ride safe.

US Metzeler Moto




The head of racing for Pirelli also disagrees with you
http://www.sportrider.com/tips/146_0810_how_to_warm_up_new_tires/index.html

As does Dunlop
http://www.dunlopmotorcycle.com/info-center/care-and-maintenance/#tip

:dontknow:

It seems to be that they say to take it easy for a bit so that the tire gets to heat cycle a few times and the nice smooth surface gets scuffed up a little, but none of the 3 use mold release agents anymore.
 
1 - 20 of 25 Posts
Top