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Old 05-08-2013, 08:16 AM   #1
DeltaPapa
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Tire scrub in

I have had many new tires. .I always break them in before going all out.
My question is has anyone ever actually "scrubbed" the tires with sand paper and soap? How do you do it beside the norm of riding it? Street tires
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Old 05-08-2013, 08:26 AM   #2
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Re: Tire scrub in

Speaking of new tire scrub in..I'm about to scrub in these Z rated puppies! Haha
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Old 05-08-2013, 11:34 AM   #3
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Re: Tire scrub in

I let UPS scrub them in for me. By the time they show up at my door the mold release has rubbed off on the rest of their packages.

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Old 05-08-2013, 11:48 AM   #4
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Re: Tire scrub in

i ALWAYS take brakecleen to new tyres...i know, supposedly there're not using the same relase stuff, but, it's cheap insurance and piece in MY mind...

as for the other 'scrub', for me it's between 30-45 miles before i, umm, get crazy...lol
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Old 05-08-2013, 12:03 PM   #5
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Re: Tire scrub in

sandpaper and soap?
brakecleen??
seriously?

with the time it takes to do that, just do a few laps around the block and yeah, don't push it too hard.

Watch the pro's at the Daytona 200. Yeah I know they are pro's, but most of them leave pit lane with the tire sticker still on the tire, and they head into turn 1 at 85%. And 85% for them is like 250% for the rest of us.
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Old 05-08-2013, 12:04 PM   #6
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Re: Tire scrub in

No. I've never done it. No, I've never wrecked on new tires.

Yes, I think you're doing a lot of work for no gain.

Yes, I think it's more than a bit foolish.
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Old 05-08-2013, 12:09 PM   #7
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Re: Tire scrub in

Quote:
Originally Posted by phoenix View Post
sandpaper and soap?
brakecleen??
seriously?

with the time it takes to do that, just do a few laps around the block and yeah, don't push it too hard.

Watch the pro's at the Daytona 200. Yeah I know they are pro's, but most of them leave pit lane with the tire sticker still on the tire, and they head into turn 1 at 85%. And 85% for them is like 250% for the rest of us.


do you know WHY they leave the stickers on?? the adhesive left on the tire really mucks up tirewarmers, so much for THAT idea!!

and, for the xtra couple mins it taked to wipe down the tire before install is ok by me...
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Old 05-08-2013, 12:23 PM   #8
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Re: Tire scrub in

I'm not home, so can't get the links, there are no release agents in tires anymore. Haven't been for over a decade. People at the track throw a new set on do one lap at 85% then second lap are at 100. And no that's not moto gp I'm talking about, but every single track day. If breaking in a new tire on the street take it easy for ten twenty miles. That's it. You just need the tire warned up and to watch out for the soap they used to get the new tire on the rim.
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Old 05-08-2013, 12:31 PM   #9
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Re: Tire scrub in

Heres the link, http://www.sportrider.com/tips/146_0..._up_new_tires/

The whole tire scrubbing thing is about the equivalent to sport bikes as the do not use the front break myth by harleys.

Quote:
Few aspects of riding technique are as clouded with the dark specter of myths, old information-or just plain bad information-than how to warm up new tires. In fact, many of us, me included, still use the misleading terminology of "scrubbing" in new tires, which wrongly implies that the surface of the tire itself needs to be scrubbed or abraded to offer traction. While this may have been the case long ago when manufacturers used a mold release compound, it most definitely is not the case today.

To clear up the issue of how to ride on new tires, we cornered Cristoph Knoche, the Racing Manager for Pirelli Tire North America's Motorcycle Division. Knoche has been with Pirelli for 13 years, working with the company's R&D department while involved with World Supersport, where Pirelli won the World Championship with Fabien Foret while battling against the other brands prior to the series adopting Pirelli as the spec tire for World Supersport and World Superbike. More than just a racetrack technician, Knoche also has first-hand experience with the prototyping process and development of special racing tires.

First off, Knoche quickly dispatched the old wives' tale that the surface of the tire needs to be scuffed or roughed up to offer grip. "Maybe it's coming from the old days when people were spraying mold release on the tread when the molds were maybe not that precise," Knoche speculates, "and the machinery was not that precise. But nowadays molds are typically coated with Teflon or other surface treatments. The release you put in there (in the sidewall area only, not the tread) is for like baking a cake, you know, so that it fills all the little corners and today that is done more mechanically than by spraying. The sidewall is important because you have all the engraving in the sidewall [with tire size, inflation pressure and certifications] and that you want to look nicely on your tire, so that's why we still spray the mold release there."


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Knoche discusses tires with...
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The next myth we see perpetuated nearly every time we watch the warm-up lap to a race. Riders begin weaving back and forth in apparent attempt to scuff the tread surface (which we've already discounted) and generate heat. The reality is that, according to every tire engineer that I've asked, there are far more effective ways of generating heat in a tire that are also much safer. Rather than weaving back and forth-which does little in the way of generating heat but does put you at risk asking for cornering grip from tires before they're up to temperature-you're far better off using strong acceleration and braking forces, and using them while upright, not leaned over! Acceleration and braking forces impart far more flex to the tire carcass, which is what generates the heat that then transfers to the tread compound as well (you often see Formula 1 cars weaving violently back and forth because automobile tires operate on a horizontal plane, so they have and use significant sidewall flex to generate heat).

All I can say is that you should trust the educated opinion of tire engineers over the old habits and superstitions of even the best racers. That said, I still-out of habit-occasionally catch myself weaving out of the pits on fresh rubber before chastising myself and then applying heavy yet smooth acceleration and braking forces into the tire while keeping the bike relatively upright.

If you're a racer, or a serious enough track-day rider to have tire warmers, Knoche recommends that you have them on the bike for a full hour to get not only the tread surface of the tire, but also the entire carcass and sidewall section, up to temperature as well. "With modern compounds," Knoche explains, "there are a lot of waxes and oils and (we) have to get them really to temperature. We suggest to get them up to around 165 degrees Fahrenheit. Because what happens is you have to warm your tire not only on the surface but what we look for is touching the wheel and you want that a little bit more than hand warm."


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Knoche and another Pirelli...
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In addition to warming tires up before the session, Knoche also recommends that riders coming off the track get the warmers back on to prevent the tires from cooling and going through another heat cycle. "Even with the tire on the warmer all the time," warns Knoche, "it takes about two laps to get to the good compound underneath, a little bit."

It should be noted, as well, that unlike many tire brands that give suggested cold tire pressures, Pirelli prefers to set tire pressures after the tire is up to temperature (165 degrees F on a warmer or after 10 minutes of lapping the track). Knoche says that pressures vary slightly depending on track conditions and rider preference but that the Pirelli engineers prefer to run from 32 to 34 psi in the front and from 28 to 30 psi rear. They like to see between a 3 to five pound rise in pressure from the initial cold tire to one at 165 degrees or above.

It might follow that suggested cold tire pressures would start 3 psi below the pressure listed above, but Knoche wasn't comfortable making that suggestion. Instead, he recommends, as many tire engineers do, that riders, "contact our technical support people."

Many years ago I recall a coworker at Motorcyclist magazine telling me that it could take as much as 100 miles for a tire to truly break in and offer good traction. I doubted that it was true then and it certainly isn't true today. Knoche reaffirms that there's no need to believe that old myth that often left typical street riders riding away from the dealership on new tires literally white-knuckled with fear of the "treacherously slippery" tires.

"I would say nowadays if the surface looks like new-as long as you don't have contact cleaner on, no soapy water (often used by tire fitters to help slip the bead over the rim) or oil-there should be no concern," said Knoche. But that isn't clearance to simply go for it, either. "For sure a new tire, especially if you change the brand or even get a different production lot, it can be slightly different," Knoche said. "So I think that's more the concern people should have. Maybe with a new set of tires that's a new experience. Get the experience; it's like riding in a brand new car, you don't race around the first corner because you don't know what's going to happen."

Finally, there is the aspect of using race tires on the street. Interestingly, Knoche says Pirelli's street and DOT race tires should come up to temperature equally quickly and at no time does the race compound offer less traction than that of the street tire. However, this is not a statement that we feel can be safely applied to all brands of tires, as we've heard differently from tire engineers (not marketing managers) from other companies regarding their specific brand. Regardless, there are plenty of other reasons not to run modern DOT race tires on the street, not the least of which is tread life that can be as short as 300 miles of aggressive riding! That's a cost of well over $1.00 per mile. Such are the compromises required to run at the front of the pack in AMA Pro Racing competition.

"That's why we developed the Diablo Corsa III," said Knoche. " This tire has, in the rear, three compound sections. The center is a street compound but on the side you have about one and half inch, probably, of our race compound, which gives you a little bit more fun." Take a look at any competitive DOT race tire and you'll note the scarcity of tread grooves in general and the total lack of them anywhere near the edge, or shoulder, of the tread. Even for track day riders that may face damp or wet riding conditions without the luxury of a spare set of wheels with wet weather tires mounted up, Knoche recommends the equivalent of Pirelli Diablo Corse IIIs, "so that we don't have to change to intermediate or rain tires because they're designed for the street.



Read more: http://www.sportrider.com/tips/146_0...#ixzz2SiuiIYAi
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Old 05-08-2013, 12:55 PM   #10
Bruce C
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Re: Tire scrub in

Quote:
Originally Posted by DeltaPapa View Post
I have had many new tires. .I always break them in before going all out.
My question is has anyone ever actually "scrubbed" the tires with sand paper and soap? How do you do it beside the norm of riding it? Street tires
I get them warm, then a little excursion on the road's dirt shoulder helps clean off any mold release compound.
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