No spark or blinkers, and a mess of wires... argghh

[Spickermayne]

Hi guys. A couple of months ago I picked up a pretty mint looking 19k '00 SV650 from craigslist that wasn't running for $1200. The dealer said it had been sitting for 3 years and just needed battery, good fuel flush and carb cleaning. I missed having something to tinker with and figured it'd be a fun project bike.



I downloaded the .pdf suzuki manual and the carbs were pretty easy. Slapped it all back together with new plugs and a fully charged, fresh Yusa reading 14.2 volts. Wasn't cranking, so I checked the 30amp fuses. one was blown, so I replaced it and vola, it started turning over... without even a hint of wanting to fire up. Knowing the fuel was good, I pulled the plugs, grounded them, and realized I was getting no spark at either cylinder. Also, all the lights works except for the blinkers.


So I immediately tore it all back down and went at it with the meter. All fuses are good. Removed all the connectors I could find and sprayed them with electrical contact cleaner. The igniter coils are reading 12.6v and so are the spark plug caps.



Discovered two wires that had broken loose from this connector. From the electrical diagram I discovered one was a neutral light indicator, and the other was from the kickstand switch. snipped the old connector off and just re-connected them all individually. Didn't change a thing about the spark situation.



Here's the mess of a front wire harness. I'm assuming all the loose wiring is from the speedometer that the bike was missing when I bought it. The green ignition connector didn't have any signs of corrosion or melting when I checked it (read it can cause similar starting issues.)



As you can see, the guy who owned it before me bypassed the clutch position sensor. I suspected he might not of done it right and that could be the issue, but when I disconnect these wires the bike won't turn over. I have since taped them up really well to the rest of the bundle.


After knowing that the coils had the right voltage, I began suspecting the spark generator/stator. I created one of the LED generator testers that I found a diagram for on another thread, and tried it out on the big connector that goes up the the igniter box. Although they were weak, the lights did flash back and forth when I cranked the bike over. I originally suspected that the kickstand sensor was the culprit but the bike wouldn't even turn over in that case, right? Would not having a speedometer affect anything? Could be the issue be tied in with the fact the blinkers aren't working?

I ordered a Haynes manual today with some hopes there might be a better troubleshooting guide in there than the service manual has. I'm tempted to find another stator and igniter box on ebay to see if one of them is the issue, as I'm running out of ideas here. The last owner seems to of done a lot of his own electrical work from the look of some of the wires, so I'm skeptical that it might be something easy that I'm overlooking. This "weekend project bike" as describe is turning out to be much more of a headache than I planned on it to be and hope some of you guys can offer some good insight.

[brle7817]

My first inclination would be the cdi/ignitor...but I would focus on the wires leading to and from it. Given your wiring headache, I would bet there is a poor connection along the way.

[RMAN]

If you disconnect the clutch switch wires as you found out, the engine will not crank over. You must have those wires connected to each other for the engine to crank. The sidestand switch will allow the engine to crank but not start because it cuts power to the coils. With a meter you can test the output of the stator and whether anyone of the phases is grounded or shorted. The Haynes manual will show you how to test as well as the R/R. Since there is no spark and no signals I would look at the sidestand switch relay which also houses the indicator relay. Two separate relays, but maybe the wiring is messed up or loose. This relay is under the seat above the battery. Don't go out and buy parts you don't need until you test those parts.The Haynes manual is very similar to the Suzuki service manual. You don't need a speedo to run an engine. You're on the right track in testing and looking into wire connections. Take your time and be logical. You unfortunately can't test the ignitor. You would need to swap a working unit in to test.

Just so you know, there are two 30A fuses at the starter relay, only one is active, the other one is a spare.

What were the colors of the two wires that broke off from the connector?
Did you test the fuses with a meter for continuity and also for power on both sides? Especially #s 3 & 4.

Here's a link to the gauge wiring diagrams with color coding provided by TeeRiver when you decide what to do about gauges, either oem or Vapor or something else. http://www.svrider.com/forum/showthr...=155361&page=2

[Spickermayne]

Thanks for the help so far guys, here's what else I've discovered...

RMAN, I checked out the turn signal relay earlier. un-snapped it, cleaned the terminals and prongs, slap it back together and did a volt reading at the orange/green wire. It has 12.1 volts. I also did a continuity test on the light blue wire. When I press the signal button to the off position it reads 12.2 volts. For a left turn, .8 volts, and for a right turn, .3 volts. Manual doesn't really describe how it should behave so maybe you can tell me if that's normal or not. What's confusing is, when I test the back bulb sockets with the meter, both of them read a constant 12 volts when I signal them. Yet when I attach the bulbs, no blinking. Could it be a grounding issue? Maybe all the bulbs are blown, but that seems unlikely. I don't have new ones but I traded them all out with each other and got no results.

Also, I'm reading 11.9 volts at the CDI connector (orange and yellow wires.) Probably a little low cause my batteries getting drained from all this tinkering around, gonna' recharge it tonight. So it's definitely getting power, and as I described, I checked the green and white wires coming from the stator with my LED tester I made and I am getting a signal from the pulse generator.

Gonna perform some more tests on the stator and then the RR and I'll let you guys know how it goes.

[RMAN]

Do the bulbs light at all with 12 volts at the socket even if they don't blink? Can you hear the relay clicking on/off when you use the signal switch? The two wires you reconnected, neutral lamp and sidestand; was the neutral lamp wire Bl/B and the sidestand wire G? What about the B/W wire from the sidestand switch, the ground?

[Spickermayne]

Ya' know, now that you mention it... there is no clicking of the relay when I activate the signals. The only time I hear it is the one click when I turn the ignition on. And yes, although the 12 volts at the sockets are there, the bulbs are completely dead all around the bike. I'm going to go get a new bulb or two today to confirm this, but they appear to be just fine.

Did a resistance check on the coils today. Primary resistance was 6.0-6.2 on each coils, which is about .5 over the recommended specs. Dunno if this is a big deal or not. Secondary resistance was fair, around 28.

Also, did a continuity and resistance check on the stator. All was in accordance there as far as I could check. To test the output, it appears I need a peak voltage adapter and for $80, I'll definitely pass.

As for your wiring question I was a little confused, figured a better picture of the re-connecting job I did would suffice though:



As for the side stand switch, I put the bike in gear and checked the voltage at the coils with the stand up, then down. It responded as it should, and I could hear the relay doing its job. So wiring on that side is definitely legit.

.

[Spickermayne]

This is sort of a bump. Also... something crazy happened today when I was browsing google under the search "bad signal relay sv650."

http://www.svrider.com/forum/showthr...360&highlight=

^ That thread came up under the search. The guy describes that he bought the bike with no speedo or working blinkers. I thought "Wow, sounds just like my bike." Then I glanced at his avatar--- which is a picture of my bike, tacky bomber girl tank stickers 'n all.

Although he was just as clueless as I am, in other posts he DOES mention the bike "ran like a champ." That was two years ago, but considering his blinkers weren't working, I'm convinced it's an un-related issue.

Another clue I noticed, he mentioned the front light dimmed when he was braked. Someone suggested that his R/R might of gone sour and was causing this to happen. If I have read right, can't a bad R/R lead to the igniter burning out?

The Hayne's manual I purchased has no instructions for testing the R/R, aside from making sure all the connectors are intact. Does anyone here have some more detailed course of doing so?

[RMAN]

If the R/R overcharges the battery, it can also take out the CDI box and stator. Here's the Suzuki manual page on testing the R/R, although this only is a static test of the diodes. Did you ever get the bike running? If not, check the R/R from this page at least. The thing is, you don't need the R/R connected to start the bike and run as long as the battery is okay. The stator output when running should be at 5Krpm >70VAC for each phase, wire. But, if you can't start the motor, you can't check the output of the stator or R/R.

[Spickermayne]

No, the bike has never ran for me personally... just the previous owner who I discovered on this forum. I'll do this test tomorrow RMAN, thank you.

[RMAN]

You might want to test the continuity of the green wire from the sidestand relay to your new connector where the switch once was. Maybe there is a break in that wire. There is either a bad wire somewhere or maybe your ignitor is bad or maybe the wiring from the neutral switch is iffy as well.

Just reread that you tested the sidestand switch, so I guess the wiring there is okay.

Check the voltage at the ignitor between the O/W and B/W with the ignition on.